Basement X

Slowly it looks like a sure thing that the digital purchases will get bigger and bigger. Presumably not though many new comic purchasers though, but rather through digital converts.

At the moment, prices are the same for print and digital. In the case of some Marvel books, a purchase of the paper format gets you a digital code for you to receive the digital format of the book you bought. I think there's a month limit though on when you can use the code. This is a good idea, but for those of you buying these types of Marvel books, how many of you are making use of the code? I'm not. I love the idea, but I feel I'd find it too tedious to go through the steps of getting the free digital format of the paper book I just bought. If there was a device that allowed you to hashtag scan the code, that would gurantee the download. Anyway, this is a side point...

Comics take up a fucking shit load of space. Cutting back on what you get each month is prudent, and space saving. But, it only really delays how quickly you fill up space with boxes of comics.
I don't know about the rest of you, but I've consumed and acquired way more music, film and TV files through, 'sharing' than I have through, say Amazon. I used to love getting limited edition, funky DVD boxsets, but space is a premium and instant access on a laptop, tablet, smartphone or even your TV is so much more highly valued at Stockwell manor.

I don't think paper comics will come to a final close. I think it will go on, but at reduced numbers. The fall will level off at some point and remain steady. If nothing else, first issues and special collected editions will always go on, but eventually, it seems like the specialist retailer will disappear and the majority of comic sales will be digital.

I know some of you are far ahead of me in terms of reading digital comics (through 'sharing' )

BUT, really, how long is it before you find yourself buying most online?


As an additional point, let's consider price some more.
Who here is willing to pay the same price for digital as you do for paper, off of the argument that digital doesn't carry advertisement?
It's interesting, but I don't see this as 'added value' I see it as value that would ideally have always existed. I think the price should be lower for digital, because of the absence of print costs.
Furthermore, surely it's only a matter of time before digital editions come with advertisement?

As a further aside, we would always need first issues printed, if we were to get books signed.

Print makes too much money for it to go away.

You can have no variants, second printings, 1:15, 1:10, 1:20, 1:200 covers in digital. Marvel and DC's business model is based around them.

Point B.
When you buy digitally, you rent, you don't own. If you look at Comixology, etc ToS, it states that if they retain the writes to the comics. If they ever close up shop, all your comics go with them. Doesn't a lot of the tablet reader programs have advertisements anyway?

Torrent will always be popular. Comics are getting too expensive for many to read, because lets face it, most comic readers don't have a ton of disposable income.

Over the last few months I have loaded old series (60-300 issues) onto my android to read, and I like it. I still much prefer paper, but I do with books as well. It's easier on my eyes, and I enjoy having the actual product.

However, I find myself more and more downloading stuff to try, instead of running around trying to find it. Instead of spending $20, or going to every shop in town on the sold out Injustice 1 and 2, I downloaded. It was awesome, so I just nabbed it off ebay.

Any digital comic I like, I have a paper copy of, and I think that will stay the same. I can see myself trying more new series before buying them. The amount of reluanches and creative changes are really pissing me off, and I don't want to give the big 2 more money for that shit.


That being said, any established comic I read, I will always buy a copy of. Especially creator owned stuff.

I can safely say all media I get is either through torrent, my local cinema and bookdepository.com, and my LCS. You can guess where the lions share comes from.

I don't know if I will go full digital, one day. I like going to the store. I like reading the floppies.
So far, the only advantage I see in digital is storage. I'm really running out of space for my comics so there is that.
Another thing that's keeping from full digital, apart from the fact that I would have to buy a tablet, is the fear of the Comixology closing. What will happen if one day, they have to close down? What will happen to the comics I own digitally?

There are two models so far for digital purchase. The House to Astonish guys actually talk about this in the most recent podcast.
There's the library rental and then there's buying the copy.

Comixology for all intent and purposes is the buying method. I would need to double check, but I think you can download a copy to your personal computer rather than read it on-line.

Cam, where do you get your information? If this industry is anything like newspapers and magazines, then year on year, it's plummeting. However, the following is surprising, provided the estimates aren't carrying many caveats - 2012 comics sales approximately up on 2011 by 15%. I was not expecting that at all!
http://www.newsarama.com/comics/decembe ... harts.html
Ad revenue must by down YoY. So many house ads in comics these days. There are more big brand adverts in comics these days, like car advertisers, but I can't imagine ad revenue is up.
15%? I really don't understand this, I need more data. Plus, does this correspond to approximately 15% new customers of the total? Or is it that more existing customers buying more comics than they did in 2011? Maybe Marvel's schedule of more than 12 issues for a title in a year is paying off and 2013 vs. 2012 will tell a different story.

Stocky Boy wrote:
Cam, where do you get your information? If this industry is anything like newspapers and magazines, then year on year, it's plummeting. However, the following is surprising, provided the estimates aren't carrying many caveats - 2012 comics sales approximately up on 2011 by 15%. I was not expecting that at all!

I should find the article, but common sense dictates the variants a bit for digital.

If the 1:whatever variants go away, and there is no incentive to buy extra to get it, how far do you think Marvel and DC titles would plummet? 20%?

Then on top if it all speculators would be gone. No more buying 5 copies of every Image book hoping for the next Walking Dead. I know people who actually do buy 5 of every Image first to come out, and store owners who order 50 extra copies of a comic they cannot sell to make it back on a customer than wants to pay hundreds for a variant that will onlybe $40 maybe in a year or two.

I know those are both different markets than the BX people, but they are there, and they are big enough to make a difference.

I'm mainly digital now simply because I'm running out of physical space to hold the comics. I don't have a lot of storage at my house and the basement is shitty and leaks all the time so it's not safe for comics. I mainly spend most of my money on variants with just a handful of regular covers.

I probably will go (full) digital in the future, maybe over the next several years but I’ll still purchase physical copies of the comics I really enjoy. I’m not doing it a lot right now, but I am testing the waters. I have a few digital codes, I just can’t be bothered to actually load them and see how it all works.

Space is a major issue for going digital. Currently, my collection doesn’t take up a whole lot of space. Most my comic boxes fit snugly inside a broom closet; however, it’s only a matter of time before I have new piles of boxes in other areas. That’s what prompted me to try and sell off some books that I don’t read/like anymore. Another factor is convenience. If I’m on a train or bus for an extended ride, I want to be able to read a comic without fear of it getting mashed up by a clumsy passenger. Or if I’m away from home on vacation and don’t want to carry a bag full of heavy trades with trades with me, I can simply read them on my tablet.

One of the reasons I am hesitant to go digital now is because of the uncertainty of digital distribution and what it means for the consumer. If Comixology does shuts down, will I lose all the digital comics I purchased? Some say yes, some say no. It’s not too farfetched that you may lose them given how vague the language is regarding ownership of digital comics and how the language is constantly evolving. Losing your entire digital collection is a realistic enough problem for me to not invest in it yet.

Am I overreacting? Maybe, but as an example, if you currently buy something from the apple store or a book from amazon’s website for the kindle, legally, both apple & amazon can delete/have it deleted from your device if they suspect you have illegally shared it with someone else, regardless of having actual proof. When you sign that 50,000 page agreement with apple before you purchase something, that is one of the terms. Amazon has a similar caveat in their Terms of Service agreement.

Eventually I think all comics will go digital whether consumers want them to or not. That doesn’t necessarily mean the end of print comics but they will be produced at a fraction number they once were, if not less. Technology is simply headed in the direction where the vast majority of media is consumed online because it cuts down on various overhead costs like printing, binding, shipping, distributing etc... Look at Netflix, where they once offered home delivery of DVDs, they now offer streaming services directly to your device/tv. This cuts down on marketing, shipping, postage, & the cost to purchase thousands of DVDs. I predict that within the next 5-7 years, Netflix will be streaming more and will phase out DVDs by mail. Within the gaming industry it’s the same thing; more people are buying games online rather than in stores. Granted the exception is you can’t buy a new release online but after several months, you can download it with all the DLCs rather than buy it.

Edit:

I dont think costs for digital comics will go down drastically because print/shipping costs will be eliminated, but rather they will be replaced with costs for keeping up a website, server and various other internet related expenses

wolf_2099 wrote:I should find the article, but common sense dictates the variants a bit for digital.

If the 1:whatever variants go away, and there is no incentive to buy extra to get it, how far do you think Marvel and DC titles would plummet? 20%?

Then on top if it all speculators would be gone. No more buying 5 copies of every Image book hoping for the next Walking Dead. I know people who actually do buy 5 of every Image first to come out, and store owners who order 50 extra copies of a comic they cannot sell to make it back on a customer than wants to pay hundreds for a variant that will onlybe $40 maybe in a year or two.

I know those are both different markets than the BX people, but they are there, and they are big enough to make a difference.

I'm uncertain about this. Even if comics go digital, you can always create incentives to get readers to buy more. i.e. When the final Gears of War game was released on XBOX, they had a promo going that if you were one of the first xxx to purchase the limited edition game, you would get exclusive online content using codes. It’s not exactly the same but I can see both Marvel and DC using similar tactics to rack up online sales, the way they currently do now with variants. They'll just need to tweak their sales model.

But it won't be the worst thing in the world to see speculators driven off. They currently screw up the market as is.

This will be interesting to monitor over the coming months.
http://www.newsarama.com/comics/march-2 ... harts.html

I was surprised by the growth in comics sales from 2011 to 2012. I really thought comics - especially print - would follow the same path as UK magazine sales, which is straight down to the gutter. Instead, I saw very respectable growth! Can't remember what the figures were for year on year, but I think it was around 15% for unit and revenue.
I'm guessing for the moment that the growth is driven by:
- New 52 still doing well in 2012
- Marvel Now kicking off last year
and in the case of Marvel especially...
- Changing practically every major title from having a 12 month schedule to something in the region of 15.

I reckon, this year vs last, will even out the number of issues each year and we'll see a decline in sales. I think the current start of the year to march comparisons begins to show this.

As I said, this will be interesting to see. I'd rather be proven wrong as see sales go up of course!

I bought a proper tablet so I'm guessing I'm a bit closer to shifting part of my comics reading to digital.

Well fuck me, sales are still strong for comics. I... just don't understand??? It's good though.
http://www.newsarama.com/17710-sales.html

Month on month and year to date both above 10% up. Is it just due to the following?
- More issues per year
- More variants
- More tie-in big events
- Company re-launches

Or, is it likely that more people are simply buying more comics and not just the regular readers?

I have no idea why either, especially when the big 2 just seem to be getting weaker and weaker.

Maybe image is just picking up a lot of the slack?

I don't think Image are contributing much other than their usual share of the sales/value. Looking at the top 100, it's a blur of Marvel and DC.

I wish I had all the data so I could plot a graph... *sigh* it's what I do.

You should do it! DO IT!

I'll take a closer look at the data myself, I am curious what us selling what.

I need full historical data to do it any justice.

Here's an article from CBR that looks into the unexpected 'floppies' sales boom.
http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/20 ... -floppies/
The author, Corey Blake concludes that DC's year zero event, variant stuff and things like Comic Book Day seem to be chiefly responsible for the unexpected boom.

Selling old books is getting harder & harder. Especially when the books you're selling have no rhyme or reason. One offs, a few issues of a series here or there, variants, freebies. If I can't fine a seller eventually I may just donate them to a comic shop - which kills me because doing that represents money I just threw away. But I suppose it's better than throwing them away. I finally understand why people threw out their books back in the olden times when they were done reading them. No more use, no more space

I know what you mean. I could unload a lot of issues at a used book store but that would be something like $0.10 an issue. I'd love to find someone who just started a comic store that is looking to double their inventory, I'd unleash a 1-2 dozen long boxes on them. Most people only want old stuff but I've got mostly new stuff from the last decade that I want to get rid of. You can try to sell them as lots on eBay but you can only get so much.

The thing with selling is, you have to be willing to take much less than you put into it. You won't get anywhere near what you paid for 90s-present books unless they're a big or in demand series like Walking Dead. I unloaded around 4 long boxes and 1 short box at a Geek Yard Sale we do by selling most books for a quarter. I billed it as 4 books for $1, but usually threw in a few extra to entice people to buy. I had a box of $1 books as well, but those just didn't move as well. I did manage to sell off the last few boxes to a dealer by just taking about $30 for 2 1/2 boxes total. It wasn't how much money I had in the books of course, but it was better than a closet full of comics that I don't read or want anymore. Along with the other stuff I sold, I made about $100 and some change. Well worth getting rid of the books so I didn't have to deal with them anymore.

If I have a run of something I offer it up to people that way first, then move to individuals. Runs are 50/50.. they either sell immediately or no one wants 20+ issues of a series they've never read so it's tough.

I don't expect to make much for it, but $0.10 is a bit too low.

Might be low, but it's still somewhat better than having them sit in your closet for months on end.